tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3071749266905309863.post3654254862030551949..comments2023-05-11T03:28:28.655-06:00Comments on The Lair of the Pterobat: New Addi(c)tions: 4Kids Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Other StuffPterobathttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03393946931686052526noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3071749266905309863.post-41963984329599661772012-11-18T18:58:39.141-07:002012-11-18T18:58:39.141-07:00I figured it was you, since I saw you reply to Sta...I figured it was you, since I saw you reply to Station 8 under the name you post here, but plugging a MotNY review. :)<br /><br />I will stop by your blog in a second, and reply to a few of the most recent posts. Reading others' episode reviews makes me want to open discussions I wouldn't want to open myself.<br /><br />I guess the biggest problem is that, for some reason, I have a tendency to talk more about works I feel are flawed or less respectable, than ones I do respect. Often the media I love the most deeply, I talk the least about. <br /><br />At the moment, I've also decided to make "Latest Turtles Miscellany" a posting habit, following my trip through the 4Kids series, and whatever other Turtles thoughts occur to me while I'm doing it. I'm still not finished season 2, but I'm close to it.<br /><br />I'll also cop to not knowing who exactly does what with 4Kids, but just that I had a general distaste for the company at the time.<br /><br />I'm starting to warm up to 4Kids April a little, and will probably be a little less harsh on her characterization in the future. I'm hoping she develops into a more distinct person later on.<br /><br />Yeah, I've given up on the Nick Turtles until I hear any better word-of-mouth. April being literally the only female character anywhere in the series is also a problem, too. Because I haven't watched the series from the start, I can't judge whether or not Nick April is just "the girl", however.<br /><br />Yeah...the idea that interspecies relationships involved a human female and a "monstrous" male has been a little bugbear of mine for a long time, and it's sucked almost all the positivity out of the metaphor, as I only see it as a way to enforce the status quo. I make exceptions for something as well-written as Goliath x Elisa, but usually these things aren't well-written, being treated just as a matter of course, that of course a human female would love anything. We're just so pure.<br /><br />That relates to the TMNT franchise in that, while Turtle/human romance sounds rare, the amount of mutant/grotesque female characters is notably lower than the already low number of female characters, which is an unfortunate problem.<br /><br />Which is why Quarry was such a nice surprise. :) Pterobathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03393946931686052526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3071749266905309863.post-50801870689763653422012-11-18T11:05:36.738-07:002012-11-18T11:05:36.738-07:00[Expletive deleted]. One wrong click, and the 90%...[Expletive deleted]. One wrong click, and the 90% finished response I had disappears into the ether. <br /><br />I can totally understand why one would feel reluctant to attack a work’s sole representative when it comes to x, y, or z group, and underlines why it’s generally a bad idea to have a group being represented by only one person. The fact that that sort of gender disparity has been more or less codified into the TMNT mythology remains one of my greater disappointments with the franchise. That said, I don’t feel any guilt in saying that I don’t find the Nick version of April is easily my least favorite incarnation of the character, and she is literally the only woman in the show’s world, outside of flashbacks and her invisible aunt. <br /><br />On a similar note, I am now wondering if whatever I continue to find appealing in April in her various incarnations is the same thing that I find appealing in characters like <em>Harry Potter’s</em> Ginny Weasley, who is also considered to be a rather hollow character by a not-inconsiderable part of the fandom. Something for me to consider. <br /><br />“Monsters of New York” is indeed my side project, born out of the belief that the two different series are meant to be best friends forever. I’m elated to have you as a reader in any capacity, and like I said, any criticism and/or commentary would be much appreciated. <br /><br />Regarding the show’s writers, I have the impression that the ratio of established animation writers to writers who’d previously worked for 4Kids is rather skewed in favor of the former, at least at first. Lloyd Goldfine is the only person in the writer side of things who I know for sure came via 4Kids, and he was on the record as being a huge fan of the original comics, indicating a more-than-merely-professional interest in making sure things went well. It’s not until latter seasons that people like Matthew Drdek (who worked on 4Kids’ <em>One Piece</em> localization) become more involved. <br /><br />I had not paid a lot of attention to the tendency for “beastly” characters in interspecies relationships to be men, although now that you mention it, it’s a hard to escape. Most counter-examples I can think of tend to be designed as humans with cat ears or green skin, rather than something which wouldn’t register as human should they be rendered realistically. <br /><br />-Ian<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3071749266905309863.post-17649966196452048862012-11-14T21:40:20.867-07:002012-11-14T21:40:20.867-07:00Well, you're very welcome, on all counts: I we...Well, you're very welcome, on all counts: I welcome you replying to my posts, because I don't get much traffic here.<br /><br />I only struggle with posting Turtles stuff because of that pure boundary between nostalgic and present interests that seems now to be breaking. I am a little unbalanced at the idea of Turtles becoming my "new" fandom, when my last fandom was something very...different.<br /><br />Of course, I also have the same frustrations you do: of being unable to find any interesting discussion on the boards. I have been poking around The Technodrome's forums for a while, and there's not much happening, nothing to make me want to join it.<br /><br />I'm well into the second season of the 4Kids series by now, and continue to be entertained and impressed. I'll save my thoughts for when I'm finished.<br /><br />I know I'm not yet at the point where I want to look at 4Kids episodes on an individual basis, but that's more of a personal preference: I haven't done episode reviews in ages, with the last ones being in Evangelion fandom in the early 00's.<br /><br />That said, I am vaguely toying with finishing and posting some of my point-form commentary on some Fred Wolf episodes that I write up in my spare-spare time. I think it's easier to talk about something when there's more to be critical about.<br /><br />Once again, I feel a little squeamish about picking on a show's major female character, but 4Kids April still doesn't feel like a "whole" character to me, like someone whose reactions I can understand and predict, who forms a consistent picture in my head.<br /><br />Her character might be doomed to be this way in all versions because she's supposed to be "the normal one", the same trap that Leonardo allegedly falls into, and no one can think of what to do with her beyond that. But I don't consider that an excuse, wanting to believe that no character type is above being written as a complete person.<br /><br />I did indeed read some of Laird's input posts, and agree that he sounds like a great editor. Just that I also noticed good animation writers like Greg Johnson and Marty Isenberg credited, and wondered if hiring those instead of 4Kids' in-house folks also contributed.<br /><br />At the same time, I can't let myself believe just because these men were involved with some bad dubbing, that they had no talent at all.<br /><br />Are you the same person who runs the "Monsters of New York" blog, by any chance?<br /><br />I'm not thinking too deeply about the Nick cartoon by this point. It's almost like this series is in the middle of the road between Fred Wolf and 4Kids when it comes to goofiness and seriousness, so it doesn't please in any way the others can't.<br /><br />I agree that Don/April has some shades of Nice Guyism, and is uncreative. Shipping April with any of the Turtles has always struck me as a little weird beyond the interspecies thing, since I see her as more of a sister-figure, even when she's closer to them in age. <br /><br />It seems that a lot of fantasy material treats interspecies relationships without the gravity or complexity they should, with Goliath and Elisa being an excellent exception. It also frustrates me that it's usually human female/inhuman male, and acting as if echoing societal standards of beauty through this is something profound and moving. (See my criticisms of fan reaction to Disney's "Beauty and the Beast").<br /><br />Thank you for the compliments on my costume. It's been almost a decade since I dressed as a fictional character for Halloween, and I liked how my searching of thrift stores turned out.Pterobathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03393946931686052526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3071749266905309863.post-78198898819065604452012-11-12T23:44:08.344-07:002012-11-12T23:44:08.344-07:00I don’t pretend to know why you keep Turtles posts...I don’t pretend to know why you keep Turtles posts, but as long as you do and don’t mind me chiming in (seriously, tell me if you do—I sometimes feel über-insecure about not being able to tell when I’m not welcome) I’ll continue to respond to them, especially as intelligent discourse on the franchise can be frustratingly hard to find. I am not complaining at all. : )<br /><br />I’m glad you’re enjoying the 4Kids show. Its first season is right up there as one of the best freshman seasons out of any show, and while Season 2 isn’t as consistent, the following two take things to a whole new level. While there are even more things I wish it had learned from Gargoyles—mostly continuity/timeline stuff and its willingness to abandon its protagonists when it suited the story—it in many way feels like an evolutionary step between it and something like <em>Young Justice</em>. If you ever feel like talking about it, I am currently making an episode-to-episode deconstruction of the show at one of my blogs, and I’d love your input.<br /> <br />You are correct in surmising that Peter Laird was instrumental in making the show what it was. About a year or two back, he actually began releasing the production correspondence he’d exchanged with Lloyd Goldfine, the show’s executive producer. From the looks of it, I’d say that about 70% of his suggestions made it to the final product, which given how substantial they could sometimes be—he asks Goldfine to scrap entire premises more than once--is quite significant. <br /> <br />My first instinct regarding April, though, is to once again disagree with you, partly because as I grew older I eventually grew to identify a heck of a lot with her perceived lack of direction after losing her job, as pointed out in the episode where her father’s antique store is introduced. It’s a really interesting character beat, and one I sometimes wish the story had tackled more often, even as I feel that it´s not something the writers would have handled with the sort of nuance it would require. <br /><br />As for the new toon, the last episode clarified something that had been bothering me, and it’s the way it wants to deal with various issues as if they weren’t complex issues with no easy answers. The last episode, for example, had Raph chewing out Leo for letting a trio of Purple Dragons the turtles had just defeated simply leave, after the gang had just tried to extort a restaurateur. The episode treats Leo as being fully in the right—the episode is meant to be about the righteousness behind showing mercy to one’s enemies--and doesn’t even appear to consider the idea that said criminals would likely then go on to commit further crimes. It makes the cartoon seem immature, in a way that would probably bother me more, if I didn’t feel like the 4Kids toon makes this one to a degree unnecessary. <br /><br />April + Don, on the other hand, feels like a badly conceived idea that is badly executed. Interspecies relationships can work—Goliath and Elisa do—but this takes none of the lessons from that and instead mixes Nice Guy ™ tropes and mixes them with the unfortunate implications that come from the fact that April is literally the only woman Don has ever known, and the only female character in the show thus far. I don’t have much respect for the pairing in general—it always seemed to me like it stems from the creatively boring idea that two people defined by the same adjectives *must* be paired together—and the show makes it a thousand times worse. <br /><br /><br />- Ian<br /><br />P.S.: I saw the Halloween costume pictures you posted a while back. You make a great Baxter Stockman. : )<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com